Reasons for bland flavourless cheese - solved

[pickles]

I make cheese that looks good, nice shape, nice colour, texture okay, goes together as it should. But it is totally bland, no taste or aroma whatsoever. It does have a very slight smell and taste of milk, but it is not cheese even though it looks like it is. I've made cheddar, caerphilly, goudda and edam, they each have this characterless character. They don't smell bad, I suppose that is a step in the right direction.

Although I haven't aged them for many months, I would have thought a couple of months should allow some flavour to emerge.

I return to suspecting my novice technique. I made all these cheeses from frozen starter cubes, all the same batch.

If my starter isn't starting could it be the reason for my bland cheese? I am wondering if I made a bad batch of mother culture, it was my first attempt and I was very much in the dark. I used a third of a small mesophilic pack, containing 4 cultures, in 300ml pasteurised semi-skimmed milk. [The whole pack is supposed to make a litre of mother culture.]

I put a new batch on yesterday, with another third of a pack of culture in 300ml semi-skimmed. I'm still not really sure whether I've got it right. It has been in a temperature controlled bath [21-23°C] for almost 20 hours now and doesn't look like it is gelling. I'll give it a couple of days and then bin it. Perhaps my cultures are dead?

Until then, though, I won't jump to any conclusions. I'm not going to give up easily. I won't be the cheesemaker who can't make cheese.

Maybe I should explore making a buttermilk based culture.

[mikekchar]

Most of the flavour in cheese comes from enzymes in the starter culture.  Basically, the bacteria grows.  After you add salt, the bacteria stops multiplying.  As you age the cheese, the cells of the bacteria break down and give up enzymes.  The enzymes then break down the protein and fat in the cheese.  This produces almost all of the flavour in the cheese.  Different bacteria contain different enzymes, which break apart the proteins at different places which produce different flavours and aromas.

There are a couple of places where things might be going wrong.  First is if the bacteria is not multiplying.  What culture are you using?  Where did you get it from.  Cultures that are meant to make mother cultures before using for cheesemaking are fairly rare, though there is nothing wrong with using them.  Keep in mind that the main bacteria are the same bacteria used for yogurt.  I like making mother cultures as well, but I tend to start mesophilic cultures at 34 C.  Usually it takes 12 hours or so to hit a pH where it coagulates the milk (quite a bit slower than a thermophilic yogurt culture.  If you are using raw milk, though, most mesophilic cultures will *not* make a gel unless you scald the milk first.  I often use UHT, homogenised milk for my starters because of that (and it's cheaper).  You should also taste your cultures.  If it's acidic like yogurt then you are good to go.  It should taste good.  If it does not, then throw it out.

The next likely place is aging.  What temperature are you aging at.  The enzymes break things down at a *much* slower pace in the fridge.  At 4 C, you might be looking at maybe 10 times longer to age than at 12 C.  6C is not *too* bad, but it's still at least 3 times slower.

Those are my guesses.  Best if you can show a typical recipe that you are making and maybe we can help a bit.

[pickles]

thanks for your reply mikekchar

It does sound to me like my starter has failed.
I made it up in semi-skimmed supermarket milk.
I intend to try making another starter which I will outline in my next thread.

The following describes the product and process that failed for me:


Cheese Culture - Standard General Purpose Mesophilic

This freeze-dried blend comprises 4 selected bacteria to ensure consistent results with a wide range of soft, semi-hard and hard cheeses.
(
Lactococcus lactis subsp. lactis,
Lactococcus lactis subsp. cremoris,
Lactococcus lactis subsp.lactis biovar. diacetylactis and
Leuconostoc mesenteroides subsp. cremoris
)

These cultures 'ripen' the milk, rendering it acidic and in the correct form for the rennet to do its job - turning milk into curds and whey.

The contents of the sachet are simply mixed with milk according to the accompanying instructions to produce one litre of starter solution, which is enough to produce over 30 batches of cheese!

The starter solution can be frozen in ice cube trays for future use.

====================

How To Make Mesophilic Culture


Before you commence the process, it is vital that you maintain high standards of cleanliness, especially when preparing the mother cultures, similar to when you’re making your cheese.

A mother culture is the base bacterial culture from which you will draw samples to use in your future cheese-making projects.

Sterilise a preserving jar and lid by boiling them in water for about 5 minutes or cleaning them then putting them in the oven at 300 degrees Fahrenheit for 15 minutes.
Cool the jar then fill it with fresh, unpasteurized, skimmed milk, leaving ½ inch of headspace.
Close the lid tightly.
Place the jar in a deep pot with the water level ½ inch above the lid of the jar.
Bring the water in the pot to the boil then leave it on a slow boil for 30 minutes.
Remove the jar from the water and let it cool to 75 degrees Fahrenheit.
Add the appropriate amount of freeze-dried mesophilic starter culture (depending on manufacturer’s instructions) to the milk while still at 75 degrees Fahrenheit.
Close the lid tightly again and gently swish the jar to mix the culture into the milk.
Place the jar somewhere that will keep the milk at 75 degrees Fahrenheit for 12-24 hours.
After approximately 18 hours you should see a solid white gel forming. If not, leave it for longer, or place the jar somewhere warmer to encourage the coagulation.
When the culture is ready, it should look like a thick yogurt. It will pull away from the sides of the jar cleanly and have a glossy surface.

===
I think I might not have left the culture long enough to develop. I thought I had followed the instructions to the letter.

By the way I have successfully made yoghurt from both full pasteurised milk and raw, with no problems. I used Fage yoghurt as a starter for this.

[pickles]

I had tried making a new mother culture. After 24 hours it looked like it had failed.
I left it, just in case, for another 12 hours and when I next looked it had actually finally gelled.
I poured the culture into an ice cube tray.
There was some culture left over so I started the Edam recipe that is in the wiki on this website.
I suspect I had not been using enough starter culture so this time I've used a bit more.
It is now on its final press and will be brined tomorrow morning.
I'm hoping it will be a cheese with flavour this time.


* later addition

the cheese has now air dried for a couple of days.
I'll age it for a week or two at 10°C and try a sample.

** later still

ripening improved the cheese no end after waiting for 7 or 8 weeks.
 

[pickles]

I made a gouda at the beginning of January. After 6 weeks the result seemed like another of my bland flavourless cheeses. I put it to one side with the others. 

I tried some today and realised that an inexpensive ingredient had been missing from my cheese.
This inexpensive item turns out to be patience. I've just been expecting too much, too soon. 
By now I think the other cheeses that had so disappointed me will have developed some flavour too.
I hope I'll be sampling and sharing them with pleasure soon. Unfortunately the 'ready in two or even six weeks' thing isn't working for me and it nearly put me off cheese-making forever.

I must get more milk and set up another cheese. It will be another Edam made with raw milk and my own-made buttermilk starter made from scratch.
I'll write up my method [partly taken from the CFO Wiki] and post a photo of the result when I'm done.
This time, however, I'll give it a good 2 months to ripen properly.

[mikekchar]

Time *does* make a big difference.  If you are making something intense like a washed rind cheese, it can be ready in about 8 weeks, but a gouda isn't really mature for at least 6 *months*.  There are lots of different styles of cheese and many of them are mild flavoured.  Personally, I really like subtly.  But if you are going for something with a really sharp bite, then it needs to be stored for 6-12 months minumum.  The way to deal with it is just to have a huge backlog.  That's why you see people with big fridges filled with 20-30 wheels of cheese.

It's funny.  My parents used to have a wine cellar when I was growing up.  There were about 3000 bottles of wine in it.  I always thought this was an insane amount of wine to have in your own home.  I mean, it's not a wine shop :-).  But then I did the math.  My parents drank wine almost every day -- not a whole bottle, but a glass or two.  And then they had dinner parties where they served a couple of bottles of wine.  On average they drank about 1 bottle a day.  That's 356 bottles a year.  Many of those bottles of wine hit their peak after 10 or 15 years -- some even 20 years.  The 3000 bottles represents aging each bottle of wine for just over 8 years on average.  Even with 3000 bottles of wine on hand, my parents were often saying that they needed more space to age wine :-)

If you eat 100 grams of cheese a day on average, that corresponds to 35.6 kg of cheese in a year!  If you make 1kg cheese wheels, then you need at least 16 in your fridge at all times if you want them to last 6 months on average.  It seems like you are not keen on fresh cheese styles, so maybe doubling down like this will be the way to go.

[pickles]

thanks for taking the time to reply mikekchar.
I have a very eclectic taste in cheese and wouldn't say there was one cheese type or another I would exclude from my cheese board.

I am very much a newbie cheesemaker.

At first I was trying to make cheese with a few drops of rennet as instructed by the bottle.
When I stepped this up to 1/3 to 1/2 a teaspoon I suddenly found out at last that I could get a clean break.
I appreciate that it is possible to use too much rennet but I was using far too little.

The latest 'problem' concerning flavour had to do with setting up a mother culture properly, I think.
I also need to give my cheeses chance to ripen.
As a test, to see if I've got it, I'll make another Edam.

I've just been down to the local farm for 4 litres of raw milk. I'll make that small Edam today using a home-made buttermilk starter.
I'll post my method and findings in the  'RENNET COAGULATED - Semi-Hard "Sweet" Washed Curd' section.

In these viral times, being aged and ripened, my wife and I are not ill, but self isolating as a precaution.
This is an opportunity to get on with the delights of putting a cheese together.

Cheese, Grommet, is round and makes the world go around.

[pickles]

A collection of cheeses, a gouda and two or three edams, made at the time this thread was posted, have all now been sampled.
Seven or eight weeks have passed since they were vacuum packed.
I'm pleased to comment they they all tasted good, had the typical texture for their type and have been enjoyed by myself and my wife.
I will most certainly be making more, I found the results very encouraging.

Simply put, the problem was my lack of patience easily corrected by waiting a little longer.