Salt Content from Brining

[rsterne]

For a while now I have been using a 21% brine, and I have kept track of the amount of salt I have added over about 6 months.... I brine about 4 cheeses between checking the salinity and adding salt, and over that time the salinity drops to about 19.5%.... I find out that on average I add about 1 tablespoon of salt to my 2 litres of brine for each cheese I have brined to bring it back up to 21%.... That works out to 2/3 oz., or 0.04 lbs. on average per cheese, and my cheeses average 2 lbs., so that is 2% salt by weight.... The volume of my brine actually creeps up over time because the brine absorbs water from the cheese, replacing it with salt.... I am Pasteurizing my brine every few months, just to make sure nothing grows in it.... I never allow it to drop below 18% salt by weight, which should keep all the beasties in check anyways....

I use an hydrometer to check the density, as per this link.... http://cheeseforum.org/forum/index.php/topic,19200

I brine most of my ~2 lb. cheeses (8.5-9 litre makes) for 8 hrs., unless they call for less (eg. when using Propioni Shermanii, which is inhibited by salt, I then use 6 hrs.) or more (I have used up to 12 hrs. for a Romano, which is supposed to be salty).... Most of my cheeses are between 2-2.5" thick, so that works out to longer than the simple formula that some of you use of 1 hour per inch of thickness per lb.... Using that, a 2 lb. cheese 2" thick would be 4 hrs. and a 2.4 lb. cheese 2.5" thick would be 6 hrs.... The uptake of salt is not linear, and while those times may well be enough, I have never found a bit more to cause the cheese to be too salty.... and it turns out my salt content is ending up at about 2%, which is pretty typical....

Bob

[rsterne]

It occurred to me after writing the above that there may be a simple way to figure a multiple to use with the "brining times" formula to achieve different salt content.... I dug around and found a table giving the typical salt content (% by weight) of commercial cheeses, and picked out the ones that are brined.... Here is a table showing the typical salt content of a few commonly brined cheeses....



I am wondering if you could use the above numbers as a multiple for the time calculated using the thickness and weight of a cheese, as follows....

Thickness of Cheese in inches = T
Weight of Cheese in pounds = W
Percent of Salt desired = P

Time in hours to brine the cheese = T x W x P

eg. for a 3" thick cheese weighing 6 lbs, where you want to end up with a 2.0 % salt content (eg. a Gouda), you would use....

Time = 3 x 6 x 2 = 36 hours

I know this formula is pretty close for my 2" thick, 2 lb. cheeses (I do a Gouda for 2 x 2 x 2 = 8 hrs.).... How do you think it will work for larger cheeses?....

Bob

[mikekchar]

I tried to do this dance for a long time and eventually decided that dry salting is just better.  There really isn't much difference in outcome for the home cheese maker but it's *so* much easier to control.  I think for a commercial producer, brining is much, much easier to control since you don't necessarily have time to weigh out the salt for each cheese.  When you are making a single cheese, brining doesn't seem to make much sense.

[rsterne]

Are you talking about salting the curds, or salting the outside after pressing?.... I do the former with Cheddars, of course, but have never done the latter.... Do you weigh the curds and then use "X %" of that, and do you change the percentage for different cheeses?....

Bob

[mikekchar]

Covering the cheese after it is pressed.  Basically, after it is pressed and when you would ordinarily put it in brine, I weight the cheese and cover it in about 2% (depending on the cheese) of that weight in salt.  Normally I do it in 2 parts, so I'll do 1%, wait a couple of hours and then do the other 1%.  If the cheese is relatively soft (or high pH), I'll leave it in the mold and just sprinking the 1% salt on top.  Then after a couple of hours flip and do the same on the other side.  It's just *so* much easier and I find that I get much better control of the salt level.  The main downside is that because you have a higher salt concentration it theoretically makes the rind thicker.  I've never really noticed a difference, though.

[bansidhe]

I was wondering about just dry salting cheese for the reason you specify.  I just never really know how long I should brine since typically I have a different sized cheese and a different surface area cheese than in the irecipe I am making.  That and I forgot my Harvati in the Brine
so it sat too long.  (Yikes!). So, is there any cheese at all that should not be dry salted?  Parmesan is music saltier than Swiss..  would you still use the same % of salt to weight?  I would think not..  So is there a guide that suggests the amount of salt to weight for different cheese types?

[MacGruff]

Mikechar -

The process you describe makes sense for the top and bottom, but what about the sides?

[rsterne]

For one thing, use less salt on a Swiss, as the P. Shermanii is inhibited by it.... Otherwise I think it is pretty much to taste, but you need some to aid in preservation, of course....

Mike, does all of the salt get absorbed, and how long does it take for each side?....

Bob

[mikekchar]

In terms of salting the cheese, it depends on the cheese.  For my 500 grams cheeses, it doesn't seem to matter much.  The salt equalises within a day or two.  You can actually see a difference in the top and bottom rind -- it shrinks and so you end up with a bit of a barrel shaped cheese.  But fairly quickly it all gets absorbed and the cheese returns to its normal shape.  Generally I salt the top and the sides, wait a few hours and then salt the bottom and sides.  But honestly, after aging I would not be able to tell the difference.

It's hard to say that all of the salt is absorbed.  It draws water out of the cheese and out of the air and so basically creates its own brine.  The cheese will continue to drain a bit and the why will be salty.  However, basically if you add 2% of the weight of cheese with salt, you end up with 2% after you age it for a while.  I've found that moist cheeses will retain more salt so if I'm doing a Camembert style, for example, I'll use *much* less salt (no more than 1.5% of the total weight as salt -- sometimes closer to 1%).

[rsterne]

As always, thanks for your expertise, and willingness to share.... 

AC4U.... 

Bob

[FishFarmAndy]

On dry salting, as discussed here, salty liquid is released so I'm not clear on the equivalence of % salt addition compared to pre-form salting or brining. For a couple of recent cheeses I surface salted gradually over 48h, and the cheese sat in a fair pool of this liquid. They turned out great, possibly more salty than desired and perhaps not quite the desired texture, but ... should I allow this liquid to drain straight off? I'm concerned that my 2% or 3% will be much lower with free drainage, having made mostly pre-form salted cheeses up til now!

3kg cheese in the picture, Gorgonzola recipe but I don't have the right shape mould (mold) yet. Have more experience and success with Stilton so far.

[Aris]

On dry salting, as discussed here, salty liquid is released so I'm not clear on the equivalence of % salt addition compared to pre-form salting or brining. For a couple of recent cheeses I surface salted gradually over 48h, and the cheese sat in a fair pool of this liquid. They turned out great, possibly more salty than desired and perhaps not quite the desired texture, but ... should I allow this liquid to drain straight off? I'm concerned that my 2% or 3% will be much lower with free drainage, having made mostly pre-form salted cheeses up til now!

3kg cheese in the picture, Gorgonzola recipe but I don't have the right shape mould (mold) yet. Have more experience and success with Stilton so far.

I only dry salt my cheeses and put them inside in a stock pot. I remove the whey that accumulates in the stock pot asap so the cheese dries quickly. So far no issue with under salted cheeses.

[mikekchar]

I only dry salt my cheeses and put them inside in a stock pot. I remove the whey that accumulates in the stock pot asap so the cheese dries quickly. So far no issue with under salted cheeses.

I literally do the same thing.  I feel I have way more control with dry salting than brining.  The only time I've had under salted cheeses was with very dense alpine cheeses.  I think in that case, splitting up the salt and salting it over a period of days seems to be helpful.

[Aris]

I only dry salt my cheeses and put them inside in a stock pot. I remove the whey that accumulates in the stock pot asap so the cheese dries quickly. So far no issue with under salted cheeses.

I literally do the same thing.  I feel I have way more control with dry salting than brining.  The only time I've had under salted cheeses was with very dense alpine cheeses.  I think in that case, splitting up the salt and salting it over a period of days seems to be helpful.

Dry salting is just so convenient and yeah, it gives you way more control. Using and making a brine is such a hassle. It takes so much space and you have to put the right amount of acid, salt and calcium chloride. To reuse it, you have to use a salinometer. If it becomes moldy, you have to boil it. The largest cheese I've made was 2.1 kg. Dry salting it was a breeze and it came out perfectly salted. Yeah I also split up the salt but I only wait 4-6 hours when I apply the second and third application. Sometimes 1-2 hours when I get impatient. With bloomy rinds, 2% dry salt is just one application.

[paulabob]

I find brining a lot easier than dry salting, it always comes out perfect, whereas I have issues getting good salt retention on the sides.  I use nested ziplock bags to store my brine rather than a large tub, and use the 100% saturated, which is easier to care for (ie, no % to calculate, just make sure there is undissolved salt in your water).  I do dry salt styles that are traditionally dry salted, always a little nervous with them.