What Have I Made? :)

[UpMyKilt]

I haven't made cheese in about 4 years, but the cheese making itch came back. I'm presently in Greece, and while there are many great cheeses available here, I still like to do things on my own.

I am waiting on some cultures to arrive (hard to find them here in Greece along with other home cheesemaking supplies). I did manage to get my hands on rennet (it's sold in pharmacies here) and calcium chloride.

I had some success the first time 5 days ago with a feta style cheese - without a packaged culture. Instead, I thought I'd try and see what would happen with some whey that I had strained from yogurt I had made.

That went okay. It's cow's milk and with no lipase, probably will taste bland, but I really had an urge to get back into.

So then, a couple of days later, I got some goat's milk - 6 litres, but 2 of them are marked as 4% m.f. The other four at 3.5%

This one, I inoculated the milk with the whey from the cheese I made a couple of days earlier. More of a "let's see what happens.." kind of thing.

I brought the temperature of the milk up to about 32C (90F) and poured in a 1/4 cup of the whey, and let it sit for an hour.

Then, I added rennet - I am pretty sure it was the same amount that I had used the couple of days before - 3/8 teaspoon in the 6 litres

I checked it 45 minutes later, and it hadn't set. An hour later - same thing.

Ninety minutes later - still not set.

The temperature had dropped a bit, so I turned the stove burner back on to low (or so I thought), and thought I'd give it another half hour or so - just to see I would ever get the milk to set.

But I got busy doing something else, and totally forgot. It was several hours later, I smacked my head... ran to check things. I discovered the temperature had increased to over 40C (104), and I realized I had turned the stove on a bit too high - medium low!

BUT - I had some thickness in the milk, but couldn't really cut curd. It was kind of like yogurt.

I thought to myself.... "well... let's see what happens if I drain the way while this is hanging in my handy dandy bandana (that I've been using as a substitute for cheese cloth)".

I actually have something that is tasty. But I can't identify the taste. It's thickened up while hanging - in the sense it is now like a strained Greek yogurt consistency - perhaps even less whey than what you would find, and has an almost creamy taste with a tang, and a touch of sweetness.

I salted it and decided to let it drain another day.

Does anyone have any ideas why in the first place, the rennet did not seem to work as expected (it was from the same bottle that I used two days earlier, with an expiry date of next year, and kept in the fridge after opening)? But then after some hours, it did create something where whey could be separated from curd by draining?

Have I made something that might have a name?? 

Thank you for your thoughts!

Ian

[Bantams]

What kind of rennet - strength?
If the goat milk is pasteurized it really needs calcium chloride added. Seems much more finicky than pasteurized cow milk. 

[UpMyKilt]

What kind of rennet - strength?

Liquid animal rennet - but the label is all in Greek 

But here's the thing - the same dose I used 3 days earlier in a cow's milk, worked fine with this same rennet.

If the goat milk is pasteurized it really needs calcium chloride added. Seems much more finicky than pasteurized cow milk.

I did use calcium chloride. I always use calcium chloride (I haven't made cheese from non-pasteurized milk).

I KNOW that I added it; I distinctly recall adding it, just after I turned the stove burner on. I have this habit of adding it first thing.

My thought or wondering: I have never made a cheese with no culture - but it is my understanding that rennet will (or should) cause a curd to form, even if you have not added culture. Perhaps I am wrong...

So is it possible, it has to do with the fact i used whey from my previous cheesemaking batch, to culture the milk? That earlier cheese batch was cultured with whey from a Bulgarian yogurt I had made and strained.

I will say that what I have here, is VERY tasty! My Greek lady companion is loving it, and is demanding I repeat the failure! 

I am just trying to understand what might have caused this - I am pretty sure we can rule out the rennet and calcium chloride.

[UpMyKilt]

Okay - to follow up, I am now thinking it possibly has to do with the milk I am using. It seem that here in Greece, there are different milks that are allowed to be labelled as "fresh" milk - although all milk for sale by law must be pasteurized. But there are apparently several pasteurization types.

I tried to make another feta with goat's milk cheese that my companion purchased for me at a grocery store here. I had the same problems - the curd did not really form even though I used calcium chloride. I cannot read the Greek labels very well - but after, I retrieved the milk cartons - and oddly, they had a 3 month expiry date. Yet, the milk was not labelled as UHT and was in the refrigerated section at the grocery store; not in the UHT milk section. UHT milks also have a much longer shelf life than 3 months.

In trying to research in English, I came across this:

Know the labels on your purchases

"Only Greece calls pasteurized milk «fresh milk.’ But what does «fresh» actually mean? Manufacturers say fresh means milk that is minimally processed and sold at retail outlets immediately. But is milk also fresh if it is produced at a farm in northern Greece, packaged in Athens and distributed countrywide? «The ‘fresh’ label is a Greek invention – actually an advertising slogan that has been impossible to eliminate,» said Giorgos Kalatzopoulos, professor emeritus at the Agriculture Ministry’s school of food science and technology. This means it is actually «pasteurized» milk, as it is known in the rest of Europe. However, cartons of «fresh pasteurized milk» often note its freshness, something which Greek dairy firms always note. Nevertheless, according to law, milk acquires its «nationality» in the country in which it is packaged. After all, products travel freely within the EU. «No state service in Greece knows what exactly is imported and from where,» said Kalatzopoulos. In the event that «Greek milk» also contains milk from another European country, there is also the problem of double pasteurization. Milk must be pasteurized before it is exported so it doesn’t spoil. But when it arrives days later in the country where it is to be packaged and sold, it must be pasteurized again. This second pasteurization is actually prohibited because it reduces the milk’s quality. Here is how milk is categorized by law. – »Fresh milk» is the milk from a cow, sheep, goat or buffalo that has not been heated over 40C. – «Pasteurized milk» is that which has been heated to 71.7C for 15 seconds, a process which destroys all the microorganisms, but does not affect the milk’s biochemical composition. This milk may be labeled «fresh.» – «Highly pasteurized milk» is that which has been heated to 85-127C and which is not allowed to be labeled as «fresh» or «pasteurized.» The process brings about small alterations to its physical and chemical properties. – «Long-life milk» has undergone continuous heating and a brief heating at very high temperatures aimed at destroying all the remaining microorganisms. It brings about physical and chemical changes and also destroys some vitamins."

https://www.ekathimerini.com/news/31238/know-the-labels-on-your-purchases/

I guess I will have to try to figure out the labels of milk here in Greece a bit better.

[paulabob]

You can also check expiration dates.  In general, non UHT milk will have about a two week expiration date, at least for cow milk, not sure if goat milk differs from that.

[mikekchar]

It may also be micro or ultra filtered.  Basically they take milk and pass it through a series of membranes.  This filters out all of the protein from the milk and also separates it from the bacteria.  Then they mix the protein back in.  It's basically a frankenstein milk.  Since it's not heated at all, some it skirts by some regulation.  For example, in Japan it's the law that you have to show the pasteurisation temperature and time on the carton, but for micro filtered milk, there is no requirement.  In some places micro filtered milk has to be labelled to show that the protein has been altered.  There are various different terms for that (some of them marketing terms).  Usually the easiest thing to do is to look at the ingredients.  It should say only "milk".  If it has any other ingredients, then it may have been altered.  Micro filtered milk is mostly useless for anything other than drinking.  It doesn't make good yogurt or even ricotta.  Instead, you end up with a bunch of soft mush.  If you drain it for a *very* long time, it makes a really soft cheese.  There are some double/triple cream cheeses that are based on it and some people find them good.  I've never tried to duplicate it.  Based on your description, that would be my guess to what happened.

[UpMyKilt]

It may also be micro or ultra filtered.  Basically they take milk and pass it through a series of membranes.  This filters out all of the protein from the milk and also separates it from the bacteria.  Then they mix the protein back in.  It's basically a frankenstein milk.  Since it's not heated at all, some it skirts by some regulation.  For example, in Japan it's the law that you have to show the pasteurisation temperature and time on the carton, but for micro filtered milk, there is no requirement.  In some places micro filtered milk has to be labelled to show that the protein has been altered.  There are various different terms for that (some of them marketing terms).  Usually the easiest thing to do is to look at the ingredients.  It should say only "milk".  If it has any other ingredients, then it may have been altered.  Micro filtered milk is mostly useless for anything other than drinking.  It doesn't make good yogurt or even ricotta.  Instead, you end up with a bunch of soft mush.  If you drain it for a *very* long time, it makes a really soft cheese.  There are some double/triple cream cheeses that are based on it and some people find them good.  I've never tried to duplicate it.  Based on your description, that would be my guess to what happened.

Thank you for your thoughts. Seems I have a lot to learn about milks. In the past, my experience was working on a dairy farm (fresh milk is delicious after it's chilled), and the milk in grocery stores in Ontario. Almost all are pasteurized and homogenized (although in some rare places I could find non-homogenized) and could make cheese with it no problem. I even made cheese with commercial goat's milk in Ontario.

I am now leaning towards some kind high temperature or other treatment for the goat's milk I've bought here in Greece. Twice now, ended up with mushy curd - but was able to strain whey and still make a tasty thick cream cheese after hanging for a couple of days.

The cow's milk, using the same rennet, same Cal Ch. and similar cultures has been fine.