Calcium Chloride - When, Amount, & At What Temperature?

[SANDQ]

Im making a stirred curd cheddar from my own goats milk. I have been advised on this site to try adding a little CaCl. I make 1 gallon batches at a time when should I add the CaCl and in what quantities and at what temperature?

[Cheese Head]

CaCl2 is normally bought in diluted form, assume yours is.

There are some threads on it here.

CaCl2 is a rennet coagulation and most people only use when using pasteurized milk. It is definitely added before rennet, I think there is some discussion as to whether it should be added before or after starter culture or colourant such as annatto. I just add mine at room temperature as that is how I store it. I go with my bottle's dosage rate, there's a discussion here on making your own and dosage rates.

[Alex]

I use the flakes/granules version. The instructions I have say to use about 0.8-1 gram/3 liters of pasteurized milk.
It doesn't matter when it's added except when Annatto is used that has to be added as first ingredient before everything.
No need for CaCl with raw milk.

[SANDQ]

Thanks for that guys, Im not buying store bought milk, Im using my own goat milk which I choose to pasteurise. I bought some dilute CaCl today ( very cheap, compared to I see what people are saying on this site ) My bottle has no instruction on it as to dosage, infact it has no instuctions on it at all!  I am also still a little confused as how to use it. Do I add it before the rennet but as the time as adding the rennet?

[Alex]

Between Annatto (if used) and Rennet.
Let's make it very simple, add CaCl after cooling stage of pasteurization.

P.S.
If I may, personal interest, where in Israel did you make cheese?

[SANDQ]

Hi Alex thanks for that, but I'm still not quite sure of something. 1st I dont use any colour in my cheese. My method, is I heat my milk to the required temp, add M400 starter and leave for 1 hour, then I add my rennet and leave for a further 1 hour, then cut a heal my curd before cooking. Armed with this in formation, when would you suggest I add my CaCl?
You may ask about my time in Israel, no problem. I was never concerned with making cheese there, rather I worked on many of the big Kibbutz dairy farms, producing the milk, mainly in the north including the Jordan valley and the Beit Shan valley as well as others. I was there between 1991 and 1998. 

[Alex]

The most important rule in cheese making is to add Rennet as the last ingredient and not to touch the milk until curdled.
So, as per your description of the process, add the CaCl after or with the starter.

You've been in a hot climate zone. Have you been a "mitnadev"? I guess you speek hebrew? I am in Haifa.

[SANDQ]

Thanks for that Alex, yes I was a volunteer for a while, I did speak Hebrew fluently but now Ive forgoten alot, as I dont use it very much. I know Haifa very well I lived there for 2 years, opposite the theater in Hadar behind Gan Benyamin, Rehov Yoshua 11 to be exact. My ex wife ( thats when I stopped being a Mitnadev ) was from kiryat Yam. What cheeses are you making in Haifa?

[Alex]

May be some day you'll come back. You should know that the most beautyfull girls in Israel are from the "Krayot".

Cheeses I make? I like very much the French cheeses, surface ripened and rind washed cheeses.
I make Gouda with and without additives, Havarti with and without additives, Manchego, Munster, Limburger, Gruyere, Jack with additives, Tomme, Mozzarella, Haloumi, Feta, Labneh, Zfatit (if you still remember), Camembert, Brie, A wide variety of Lactic type cheeses. I mainly use cow's milk and occasionally goat's. I am trying to make Cheddar, everybody is making it, so, why not me?

I'll take the opportunity and recommend you a good book about goat cheese making, although there are only 2-3 recipes in it the theoretical part should be of interest to you:

THE FABRICATION OF FARMSTEAD GOAT CHEESE]THE FABRICATION OF FARMSTEAD GOAT CHEESE by Jean-Claude Le Jaouen.

http://www.amazon.com/Fabrication-Farmstead-Goat-Cheese/dp/0960740430/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1270394557&sr=1-1

[SANDQ]

I hope to return 1 day, I made many good friends in my 7 years. You have sparked my interest with 2 of your cheeses, Labneh and brie, I miss my labneh, and my longterm girlfriend is interested in making brie, I presume this is possible with goats milk? Ive been looking for recipes on this site and others can you point me in the right direction in the making of these 2 cheeses ( oh and a good supply of zatar ) I take it you are a sabra?

[Alex]

http://cheeseforum.org/forum/index.php/topic,3597.new.html#new

Above is the link to the Labneh recipe the way I make it. Using goat's milk will be much better than cow's milk. Zaatar you can make by yourself, here it is how:

1/2 cup of dried thyme
1 Tbs of dried oregano
2 ts of soumak
1 Tbs of coarse salt
2 Tbs of sesame seeds
Olive oil

Crush everything, except sesame and oil, with a mortar and pestle, mix in the sesame seeds and a litle olive oil to moisten the mixture.

I take it you are a sabra?

No, I am not. I came to Israel when I was 14, from the Hungarian region in Roumania, i.e. Transylvania.

[SANDQ]

Shalom Alex, your recipes are making my mouth water already! I do have a few questions concerning the Labneh recipe, Which brings me back to my original question about CaCl. I have a pre bought solution not flakes, so what quantity should I use? By enzime does the recipe mean rennet? what spices should I add? Thanks for the zaatar recipe, Labaneh without zaatar is to the English, like strawberries without cream! Small world we live in, my ex wifes mother was from the same place as you.  AM ISRAEL CHI!

[Alex]

No kidding, really small world

Personally, I don't like to add spices to the Labneh, just Zaatar and olive oil when serving accompanied with a fresh hot pita bread and some olives.
The type of enzyme I am using calls for 1 drop/1 liter of milk, and yes that's the rennet.
I've never worked with liquid CaCl, so I'm not familiar with it.

P.S. After such a long relationship, I think it's time to reveal your name, don't you?

[Sailor Con Queso]

With pre-mixed CaCl, you should probably use 1 teaspoon or less for 2 gallons. I would probaly start with 1/2 of that and see what happens. You can always adjust up or down next time.

[SANDQ]

Ma Yanim Alex? Sorry for not introducing my self, S and Q is Sally and Quentin, I am Quentin, Q for short! thanks for all the info on labneh. Are you using CaCl, because you are using shop bought milk? Where are you getting goat milk from in Haifa? Why do you think goat milk is better?
Im very impressed with your English, I count 3 languages you must speak