CheeseForum.org » Forum

Hey,

I have made neufchâtel maybe 5 times now, and it usually works, but I always need to wait much, much longer than various recipes tell me before I have a curd or clean break. I have been trying to narrow down my problems, and it seems I can't do it, and I think I need help.

I use my oven with only the light turned on and the door left ajar to maintain a fairly stable 21 degrees C temperature. I use store-bought buttermilk, which I was unsure about, but I finally picked up on the tip of thickening it before using to make cheese, so I did that, and it seemed to work fine: I got it to the consistency of really runny yoghurt, and then put it in the freezer. The product I use I am most unsure about is my rennet. I do not know where to get reliable rennet in the Quebec City region, Canada. I have some I bought at the store. I tried to test it using methods I found online, and the tests did not work. I do not know if I messed up, or if the rennet doesn't work. I am lost.

I started making Neufchâtel yesterday, with 4 liters of milk. I followed the instructions on my rennet bottle, and mixed everything carefully. In the morning, after about 16 hours had passed, I looked at how it was progressing, and there was some whey on the surface, but the milk still looked liquid, so I did not touch it. After about 24 hours, I checked in on it again, and it still looked liquid, and then I got annoyed, because it always takes me this long or longer, and it is not supposed to, according to just about every web-page I read. I came back to it tonight after about 30 hours, and I poked at it with a knife, and there was no clean break. I tried to cut and strain it anyway, and there was no whey: everything was a big, gooey white mass of... I don't even know what that is.

So... did I not wait long enough? 30 hours is a frikking long time! What is going on? What is my problem? I really want to get this recipe down so I can move to cheddar. I am truly disappointed right now. I thought it was going to work, this time.

Thanks a bunch.

Hi jloisel.

Welcome to the board. I think it will be easier for the gurus to answer this if you specify which Neufchâtel you are making. French or American, as they are entirely different cheeses. Also if you can specify the source for your recipe(s) that might help.

Hello! It is American Neufchâtel. The first few times I made it, I used David B. Fankhauser's recipe. This time, I was following the instruction from this website (http://www.cheeseforum.org/Recipes/Recipe_Cream_Cheese_Light.htm), but I don't think that the change in sources is what caused me to fail because it's essentially the same recipe.

The things that I am worried about are my temperature (I am fairly stable at 21 degrees celcius, but it did dip down to 20 or 19.5 for a few hours during the day), my buttermilk (is a runny yoghurt-like consistency enough), my rennet (does it work at all), and the time (was I just impatient or is it really abnormal to take more than 30 hours to make this cheese). It's just hard for a beginner like me to juggle all of these variables intelligently.

Jerome

Welcome to the forum, Jerome.  I'm so sorry you are having such difficulties.

I'm not quite sure, but my guess is that your rennet may be weak.  Liquid rennet loses strength over time.  My first year of cheesemaking, I used liquid rennet, for about 8 months while I had enough milk to make cheese.  Two months of the cow being dry, then I tried to make cheese again and it was an utter failure.  When I got new rennet (tablet and powdered forms), everything worked again as normal.

Are you using the same kind of milk as you did previously, or has your source changed?  That is the only other difference I can think of at this point.

Hi jloisel, welcome, I wrote that standard recipe up.

American Neufchatel or Light Cream Cheese is a primarily lactic acid coagulated cheese, rennet is optional and is normally lower than the 1/4 of your rennet's direction that I wrote in that recipe. the directions on your rennet's package are normally for a rennet coagulated cheese. Thus you should not expect to get a rennet type curd with a clean break, instead should get a very heavy thickening which you ladle whole into your draining bag or cheese cloth and hang to drain.

As per that recipe you are trying to get the good bacteria from your pre-ripened buttermilk to out compete the bad bacteria native in the milk and airborne. For the good bacteria to multiply rapidly you need strong starter and I think warmer temps than you've been down to. My room temp is commonly 77F/25C but I did make a batch at your cooler temp and it took a lot longer.

For your batch, a picture would help, my recommendations for your batch are if thickened, then place in cheesecloth sheet or bag and hang preferably at warmer temperature as long as whey discharge is normal transparent green and not milky coloured, if milky coloured then keep in your vat for a little while longer, again at warmer temperature.

Lastly, I'm in the middle of converting the whole website pages to a new system after which I will delete the old as you linked above. The new Light Cream Cheese Making Recipe page is here, I will update it with better info and pictures.

Hello!

Ok, I think that helps a lot. You might want to update the recipe to specify that 21 degrees is a minimum, not an average, because if I know which side I can err on, that makes it much, much easier. I have no trouble getting a fairly stable 25-degree temperature going; I just did not know that this was ok.

Jerome

When I make lactic acid coagulated cheese in the wintertime, my house is way too cold for them to work properly, so I set the vat into a large sink filled with water that is about 90 degrees Fahrenheit.  I cover the sink with a board to maintain temperature for a longer time.  This seems to help everything stay warm enough and works much better.

Let us know how your next batch works for you.

Quote from: John (CH) on December 09, 2010, 12:40:43 AM
<snip>
Lastly, I'm in the middle of converting the whole website pages to a new system after which I will delete the old as you linked above. The new Light Cream Cheese Making Recipe page is here, I will update it with better info and pictures.

Updated link:

Light Cream Cheese - American Neufchatel Making Recipe

a) Your milk may be ultra-pasteurized and may not coagulate properly, and b) you will be getting primarily a lactic acid coagulation and it may not provide a good clean break since you are using little rennet (or should be, maybe 1/4th the amount for rennet-coagulated cheeses).  A lactic coagulation will be soft compared to a rennet coagulation, and the "clean break" may be nothing more than a slightly goopy separation of the curds when you pull your finger through it.  I find, in fact, that the softer coagulation produces a smoother and nicer fresh cheese though, so no worries.  Try first experimenting with different brands of milk and keep your ripening temperature warm enough for sure.  Note that the online tests that I've seen for testing rennet never worked for me either, but the rennet was fine and working well.  Your rennet tests will work better if you bring the pH down a little (can't remember the optimal renneting pH) before adding the rennet.  It took me a couple of months before I discovered a milk that would work well ...the others all having been (apparently) pasteurized at too-high of a temperature.  Once you discover a good milk source, then you're on the road and can go about your new hobby with more confidence AND satisfaction.

Brian