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Hi all,

I have my own cow and have a lot of trouble getting her milk to acidify.
Her normal pH is close to 7 (6.98ish). This is her norm, has been for the 2 lactations I've had her for.  I culture her milk regularly and know it's not a mastitis issue, it's just the way it is.  It also seems to buffer exceedingly well so I have a lot of trouble hitting pH targets when I'm supposed to.

The cheese I'm making right now is a Lancashire and I've been cheddering for over 2 hours and the pH is still around 6.  I realized that I didn't check the pH at the time of draining which obviously would have been much higher than the 6.2 that is generally recommended. I used MA11, Aroma B and some Thermo C a lá awakephd's recipe.  I'm grumbling and cranky as I feel like Im going to have a very dry cheese because of the whey loss with the prolonged cheddering.

So my question specifically is, if the pH isn't correct at the time it should be drained (end of stirring) should I just let it sit, maybe stirring occasionally until the pH is right?

Since she is so buffer-y, should I be increasing my amounts of culture? Half again as much to see if that gets me closer to targets?

Thanks for any thoughts,
Teresa

Just to double check...
Do you calibrate your pH meter each time with pH calibration fluid?
Are you measuring the curd or whey portion?

Hiya,

Yes to calibration (2 point, Extech) and I'm measuring the curd (as best I can by pushing the electrode into the curd).

Cheers,
Teresa

If you drain early there's not alot you could do.   There is only so much lactose left in the curds and when the culture run out of food they stop producing acid.  Under normal circumstances draining ph is in direct correlation to final ph. 
But always check your ph meter, just last week I was in the middle of a make and found it had got out of calibration and I just about missed my draining target. 

Hiya,

So if I find the pH is too high at the time I would normally drain, is the remedy to not drain and let the curds just sit in the whey (holding temp) until the pH drops? I'm just not sure what to do in this case.

Maybe increase temperature slightly to encourage acid production?
Stir once in a while so they don't mat too much but so they don't release more whey?

And then to try and reach targets on time, increase culture amounts?

Thanks again for any thoughts.

That's what I would do, but without your full make procedure it's my best guess.  I'm not totally familiar with Lancashire but I'm guessing it in the family of cheddared cheeses.  With that I pre ripen at 88 degrees for 1 hour, rennet  per stir for 30 min cook to 102.5 in 45 then continue stirring at that temp for another 45 to 60 min.  By that time my whey ph is at 6.3, that's where I drain and go on from there.  I've found ripening temp and cooking temp are very important.  I do 60 gallon batches so it takes more stiring then a small batch would.  Hope some part of my ramblings has been helpful

60 gallons, wow!
I can certainly post the make if you want but basically ripening is 45 mins, Renetting was 50 mins (I used a flocc factor of 3.5, rest 5, stir 10, rest 5.
So not long for acidification to happen. There wasn't actually a target pH for draining stated anywhere I could see but there was for end of cheddering which is supposed to take between 30 and 60 mins to get to a pH of 5-7-5.4. Mine was about 2.5 hours. So I figured draining pH was likely too high.

This is a consistent issue with her milk; even when there is a target pH for draining, her pH is not even close to it in the suggested times so I was wondering how to deal with it.  Your advice to hold is appreciated, I wasn't sure what to do. Still very much a newbie. I'll also try upping the culture by 50%.

Cheers,
Teresa

Did a quick search on new England cheese company

https://cheesemaking.com/collections/recipes/products/lancashire-cheese-recipe.

It does not list ph markers but he cuts the curds to 5/8 inch plus the short stiring would leave enough lactose in the curd to get to the proper acidity.  I would definitely check his recipe out to see what he recommends for culture amount and cheddaring time, skimming his make it cheddared for 3 hours. 

Best of luck

Interesting that the New England cheddars so long too.

I found this from Sailor when poking around some more which explains the short times:

"Lancashire is cheddared, but for a fraction of the time used for a true cheddar. With cheddar, part of the goal is to remove a lot of residual whey and build up acidity to a pH of around 5.4. This can take quite a while depending on the culture that you use. When the pH is right the slabs will have a texture like BBQ'd chicken. Then you mill and salt to stop acidification, hoop, and press.

Lancashire is an uncooked, moist curd cheese. You want to end up with a semi-hard, creamy cheese, so you only cheddar for a short time. I flip every 15 minutes for no more than an hour. Then you mill and salt. BUT, and here's the big difference, because of the shorter cheddaring time, the cheese does not build up the same acidity - say 5.9 to 6.0. As a result, the cheese will have a much softer texture than a cheddar. And because of the higher pH and moisture content, Lancashire ages much quicker. As I said, really good even at 60 days. Lancashire probably hits it's peak before 90 days, so I don't consider it a candidate for bandaging anyway.

After salting, I hoop and press instead of letting it stand overnight. I use light pressure (like a Gouda), and I get a fabulous curd knit. I don't feel that is cutting corners, because the salt has already stalled acid production anyway. I am VERY pleased with the results."

So looks like I might have made Lancashire according to the New England recipe or just some kind of cheddar according to Sailor.

I guess I made cheese

How have previous cheeses turned out?
What is her SCC count?

Hi Bantams,

I don't know her SCC any farther than her CMT is normal.  Her cultures are all normal (last one was last Tuesday). Milk tastes fantastic.

Her milk for cheesemaking is somewhat frustrating. Fragile curd and poor yield. I get about 80% weight of what I should get according to recipes.  She is AB AB for her cheese-related proteins so I assume that has something to do with it.
Other than that, always slow to acidify and so-so cheeses (but that could be me). Feta is awesome aside from the reduced yield.

Cheers!

Hmm... That sounds really strange. Usually raw milk from a Jersey will yield about 125-140% of stated yield in a standard recipe. And the curd should be exceptionally firm and durable. (My cows are all AB and have those high yields. Not trying to brag, just what I've observed working with several different herds' milk).
I think that a components and SCC test would be interesting to see.
How long is flocculation typically?
How do you chill the milk and how long is it stored before use?
Is it possible there's sanitizer residue on the equipment?

Yup I love my cow but her milk is a PITA! I wish I could get that yield! Brag away, I love to hear that, gives me hope for my next cow. Im waiting for her daughter to freshen so I can compare (A2A2, BB, AB)

I dont think there is residual sanitizer. Her TPC is/was consistently quite low (20s-40s CFU/ml) so I consulted with a RAWMI mentor and microbiologist and we went through my sanitation protocol and they thought it should be ok. I've kind of given up investigating because its been the same for 2 years no matter what changes I do. Having said that I just changed from hand milking to machine (repetitive strain injury) and her first culture on the machine showed the TPC went from 40 to 400. No pathogens. So still well within the norms for TPC but quite a jump. I also weaned her calf at the same time. The TPC might reflect me and the learning curve with the machine rather than her although its funny that I'm doing things that should reduce TPC and potential inflammation yet her milk remains the same pH and TPC went up. Im monitoring for trends.   

Sorry, I'm not sure what you mean about component testing? Ill check into SCC testing, not sure how to do that but Ill see if the lab can do it at the same time as the culture.

I reduce the rennet just a bit and it gets flocculation to 11-12 mins.

Milk is processed immediately after milking, we chill in 2L jars in an ice bath, It takes 1.5-2 hours to get to 4C. Stored in a dedicated milk fridge that I monitor with a max-min thermometer and its holds temp right around 2-3 very nicely. Its good for at least 10 days although it rarely is around that long. I often make cheese with milk that is a few days old but Ive also made it with fresh out the cow and same results.

Thanks for helping me investigate this! Any thoughts that point me to the right direction are fantastic!

Teresa

That all sounds good! Component testing is usually performed by DHIA labs (or the Canadian equivalent). This is the test that registered herds do on a monthly basis to track the cows' production stats (butterfat, protein, etc) and SCC.
SCC and components are often paired. Our state DHIA lab charges $1.50 per sample and sends (free) reusable vials with preservative tablets (no need for ice when shipping).
Hopefully you can find a lab that does the same - it's helpful to know protein and butterfat values.

Got it, thanks!
I checked with our lab and they dont do it. The tech I asked there says we cant use the BCMMB (British Columbia Milk Marketing Board) as its only accessible to licensed dairy producers. Ill poke around a bit more but it might be out of reach for a single cow person like me. 

I appreciate all your input!
Teresa